August 2, 1994 - Part 11
August 2, 1994 - Part 11
(00:45:30) So while I have sought to try to understand the recusal issue nevertheless, there is no question before this Committee that man personally was going to somehow be involved. So for somebody who is writing a memo who wasn't at that meetin to suggest Senator DODD. The February 2 meeting. You said the 3rd. Senator KERRY. At the February 2 meeting or the February 3 meeting with Mr. Ickes, for someone to write this on February 28 saying now that Mr. Altman has recused himself, in fact, demonstrates he was not privy to any of that discussion on the 3rd or the 2nd and didn't know what Mr. Altman's true relationship to this decisionmaking was. So I would simply respectfully submit that this is, if you read the whole memo, a fairly straightforward lawyering memo, a status-oriented memo that kind of lays out where things are going and it almost shows a fairly significant lack of day-to-day knowledge of what is happening and the data significant for the quantity of lack of information. Senator DODD. If my colleague would yield. Just a step further on 'that point, I mean, it said and I'm sorry the Senator of New Mexico has left as well, with sort of the pause for drama, that Mrs. Clinton got a copy of this memo from Mr. Ickes, who is what, the Deputy Chief of Staff at the White House, as if somehow that is a major revelation and someone ought to be getting a copy of a legal memo regarding the status. Senator KERRY. I might just add, it involves the RTC/Rose Law Firm issues, the Rose Law Firm of which Mrs. Clinton was a partner. I think- I'm not trying--I think I've been fair in these proceedings, trying to find the facts. It strikes me that this is not what it has purported to be and it's important for us not to leave so now Mr. Eggleston I think is coming in. Am I correct? So we'll have ample opportunity to explore this with him but on the face of it, I think we should not draw a conclusion at this point in time. I think it's unfair. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Bennett. Senator DAMATO. Will the Senator yield for a moment? Senator BENNETT. Yes, I'd like to yield a minute to Senator D'Amato. Senator DAMATO. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to ask that the entire memo be placed in the record. The CHAIRMAN. Without objection, so ordered. Senator D'AMATO. Mr. Chairman, I just make note that Mr. Eggleston was at one of those meetings, the February 3 meeting, where Mr. Ickes came in. That's number one, so he had a little understanding and he is from the Office of White House Counsel. 539 Second, Mr. Ickes is the Deputy Chief of Staff, and I think-and he was at both of those meetings, and so I don't think we should be drawing inferences that somehow they were not in a position to understand all of the nuances With Mr. Ickes being at both of the meetings, Mr. Eggleston being at one of them. I thought I'd like to put that on the record. Senator KERRY. I think that's fair. All I'm suggesting, Senator, is I think it's important for him to explain it and put it in a context before we have a dramatic conclusion. Senator DAMATO. I thank my colleague. Senator BENNFrr. I'll yield a minute to Senator Gramm. Senator GRAMM. I'd like to add just two more points. First of all, this memo, except for the introductory paragraph, was redacted, so we didn't get it initially. We bad to go back and ask for it. So that suggests that somebody somewhere may have not wanted us to have it. Second, there is a cover memo, which neither you nor Senator DAmato referred to. This cover letter is the memo to the First Lad~ from Harold Ickes, which then encloses the memo from Mr. Egg leston. Mr. Ickes was at every meeting, and if he is forwarding this memo on to the First Lady to read, it seems to me that is clear and convincing evidence to, at least, his belief in the veracity of it. That's all I wanted to point out. Senator KERRY. Let me just say to my friend that if the issue of his being there was of such critical importance and on the 3rd, be got out-be said he was going to stay and what, the 25th, he gets out, there would have been some knowledge about who the other players were. Now, I'm not trying to exonerate. All I'm saying is you can't draw that conclusion. But second, don't make insinuations about the redactions because this entire memo is outside of the scope of this hearing. It does not involve contacts, and it has only been made available to us by virtue of the White House's willingness to clarify this, to unredact and make it available. But into the scope of this hearing, we have no right to this and it's by their judgment that they want this open that we have it.