August 2, 1994 - Part 7
August 2, 1994 - Part 7
(19:40:26) Mr. ALTMAN. No, sir, but let me illustrate, Senator Bennett, one of the things that interests me just simply illustrates differing .recollections. You've taken testimony under oath from several participants in the February 2 meeting. Senator BENNETT. No, I don't want to get off on this. Mr. ALTMAN. If I could just say this one point. Some of them say the meeting occurred in Mr. McLarty's office and some of them say the meeting occurred in Mr. Nussbaum's office. Senator BENNETT, But that's different. Mr. ALTMAN. But that's a fairly significant thing, 5 people testifying Senator under oath and they have differing recollections. BENNETT. It's different when somebody says I talked to him and you say no, I didn't talk to her, I talked to somebody else, and somehow she's mistaken. Let me get to the point, however, by taking you to the testimony before this Committee subsequent to that, whichever day it was, 460 and whether you called Maggie Williams or Mr. Ickes to request a meeting. Senator DAMAT0. Did anyone request this meeting? Mr. ALTMAN. I requested the meeting. senator D'AMATO. Was there any other meeting that may have been requested? Mr. ALTMAN. No. Senator D'AMATO. There was no other meeting that you were aware of that the White House Counsel requested? Mr. ALTMAN. No. Senator D'AMATO. Or anyone else from the White House? Mr. ALTMAN. No. Senator D'AMATO. Mr. Ickes? Mr. ALTMAN. I had no subsequent-pause-I received no subsequent request for meetings. You did, indeed, have a subsequent meeting with Mr. Ickes which you requested which you did not disclose to Senator DAmato when he asked you and specifically named Mr. Ickes. Mr. ALTMAN. Senator, I did not receive any subsequent requests for meetings. That's an accurate statement. Senator BENNETT. That's not his question. Mr. ALTMAN. Let me go on then and respond. I thought Senator D'Amato's question related to the question of whether I had been asked by the White House for any additional meetings, and he clarified his observe question. He said, in effect, you mean there weren't any other meetings requested by the White House? That's simply how I took his question and I answered it truthfully. Senator BENNETT. Well, I will leave that as the record stands. Senator Kerry tried to summarize this into two issues. Last night as we were winding down, Senator Dodd summarized it into three, and I found myself agreeing with him in his summary. He says there are really three basic issues here. The first one has to do with the independence of the RTC and whether this was subverted in this Administration. He said, I find that issue troubling, if I'm remembering correctly. Senator correct me if I have my memory wrong. I also find that issue troubling. I find your testimony troubling on this issue because it contra dicts testimony we received from both Mr. Roelle and Mr. Katsanos. Senator Dodd said the next issue is the question of being complete in your testimony before Congress, and the word Senator Dodd used, talking to Ms. Hanson, referring to the total performance of your Department was inexcusable. He said I find this inexcusable. Then be said the third issue has to do with the number of contacts and meetings with the White House, and I find that sloppy. I find my self gravitating toward these three adjectives, troubling on the First issue, inexcusable on the second, and sloppy on the third. As we bear your explanation in all of these three areas, in every case, in order to believe you, we must disbelieve other people who have sworn under oath. Specifically Mr. ALTMAN. Senator Bennett, I don't think that's true. Senator BENNETT. I'm sorry, Mr. Altman. Your version of what happened at the White House is in direct conflict with the version we have from Mr. Steiner and Ms. Hanson. Now,' we learn from Senator Gramm that your testimony is in direct conflict with 461 Maggie Williams. I cannot reconcile your description of what happened with theirs. I can reconcile theirs. Ms. Hanson's version is very easily reconciled with what Mr. Steiner told us you told him about it. Mr. ALTMAN. Senator Bennett, I respectfully Senator DODD. Just for purposes of clarification, since! my definitions are being used, the inexcusable part, if I may-and it's not much of a distinction here--was I found Ms. Hanson's waiting so long to get back, we now know, apparently, with the availability of the full tape to look at, exactly what occurred. The fact that we didn't get a more responsive answer back from her, prior to that time,, was what I found inexcusable, but basically Senator BENNETT. I'll adopt the inexcusable for the whole performance. Mr. ALTMAN. Senator, if I could respond. Senator BENNETT. Yes.