August 1, 1994 - Part 9
August 1, 1994 - Part 9
(23:40:41) Ms. HANSON. I did. Of what I recall of it, Mr. Ickes asked me who knew I had recommended to Mr. Altman that he recuse himself, and I recall giving him three names. He said, "Good, because if it got out, it would look bad." Senator DAMATO. What did you reply to him? MS. HANSON. I told him it was what I would have done if I were in his position. Mr. Ickes said, "It would be better if it didn't get out" and I said, "If I'm asked, that's what I will say." Senator D'AMATO. Ms. Hanson, you said, That's what I would do if I were in his position." You're referring to Mr. Altman's recusal? Ms. HANSON. That's correct. He was not required to recuse himself. It was a personal decision. senator DAmATO. I just want to set the record straight. Did you have any further meetings with Secretary Bentsen after the February 3, 1994, meeting at the White House? Ms. HANSON. We did meet. Mr. Altman and I met with the Secretary and Senator DAmATO. Do you recall how many occasions? MS. HANsoN. On this issue? Senator DAmATO. Yes. Ms. HANSON. On two other occasions. Senator DAMATO. Could you give us the nature of those meeting and who was there? ?is. HANSON. In the first meeting, Mr. Altman and I were there. Mr.-Altman told the Secretary that he had decided not to recuse himself. Senator DAMATO. When was that meeting? 200 Ms. HANSON. I don't recall, sir. It was shortly after the meeting at the White House, but I can't place that specifically. Senator DAMATO. Could it have been the same day, on February 3 , 1994? Ms. HANSON. It could have been. I just don't recall. Senator DAMATO. Go ahead. Mr. Altman reported on the meeting at the White House to the Secretary.? Ms. HANSON. What I recall of the meeting was that he said he had decided not to recuse himself, for the time being, and that he didn't believe it made any difference, but it made them happy Senator DAMATO. Made "them" happy, meaning who? Ms. HANSON. -which I understood to be the people we had met with in the White House. Senator DAMATO. Do you remember the Secretary saying anything about that? Ms. HANSON. I recall the Secretary saying that he thought he would-he, Mr. Altman, would take some political heat for the decision, but that it was his decision to make. Senator DAMATO. Did you have occasion, on the second meeting with the Secretary, and did you speak privately with Secretary Bentsen? Tell me about the second meeting with Secretary Bentsen and Mr. Knight, Do you know about the second meeting? Ms. HANSON. It was not a second meeting, but there was a meeting with Mr. Knight, Mr. Altman, and Secretary Bentsen. I don't recall why that meeting was called or what else took place, but I recall that Mr. Altman went through and summarized the original White House meeting and the statute of limitations discussion and said that he had reserved judgment on the recusal decision. He, then, went on to say that he had ter decided not to recuse himself for the time being. Senator DAMATo. After that meeting, did you have a conversation with the Secretary? Ms. HANSON. Yes, I did. Senator DAMATO. Immediately following the meeting? Ms. HANSON. I believe, it was immediately following the meeting. The Secretary said, "That's not exactly the way I recalled it," and I said, "I don't think it matters. I don't think it makes any difference." Senator D'AMATO. You mean, the Secretary expressed the opinion that Mr. Altman had informed him, prior to going to the White House, that he was going to recuse himself? Isn't that when the Secretary said, 'That's good. I agree with you!'? Ms. HANSON. The Secretary said, "It sounds like the right decision." Senator DAMATO. The Secretary indicated that he approved of that decision and, so now, he stops you and he says